Let's just start by saying that the Macklovitch brothers don't need an introduction, If you have been paying attention to hip hop within the past 5 years.  Those who don't know, slap your hand, and wring your ear, because you should know better.  For the slow ones in the audience, we'll just give you a quick description.  You've probably already heard the spiel about A-Trak, a.k.a Alain Macklovitch.  A-Trak, now 20, captured the hearts of the DJ-ing/turntablism world when he was like, 8.  OK, I'm lying, he did this when he was 15.  But still.  On his way to where he is today, he collected piles and piles of DJing titles, namely the ITF's, the DMC's and the Vestaxes.  His DJ-ing skills have more oomph than a can of whup ass.  He is also one of the members of the Allies, was invited by Q-bert to be an honourary member of the Invisibl Skratch Piklz, and is a DJ for Montreal hip hop group Obscure Disorder.  A-Trak also introduced a notation system for scratching in the Allies' first issue of Tablist magazine, released a 7" called Enter Ralph Wiggum on Peanut Butter Wolf's Stones Throw Records, and he still manages to practice, and be a physics student at McGill.  Overachievers can now all be put to shame.  

Dave One, a.k.a Dave Macklovitch, is A-Trak's older bro.  He's the more behind the scenes, low key one of the two.  Dave is the hip hop editor of the hilariously offensive and brutally honest Vice magazine (read The Geography of Hip Hop, this hugely seminal article about hip hop in North America), and producer of gazillions of Montreal hip hop groups - namely the aforementioned Obscure Disorder, Dubmatique, and Butta Babees.  And he's done remixes for Bran Van 3000.  He also formed a group with fellow Audio Research member P-Thugg called Chromeo, and they released an album on Turbo Recordings.  Right now he's down in New Jack City working on a PhD at Columbia University.  Again, putting overachievers to shame.  

In this issue of Keetologue, the highly knowledgeable Macklovitch brothers dispel myths about the Montreal hip hop scene, conscious hip hop, being brothers, the future of Audio Research and why it's okay to be a new jack.

Before I came to Montreal, I think the only Montreal hip hop figureheads that I could name would be Dubmatique, and you guys.  From your own experience, do you think that the Montreal hip hop scene is overlooked, or just altogether ignored?  

I think Montreal's scene tends to be a bit overlooked, but it's probably because it's not that solid. Local artists don't really get that much hometown support (compared to Toronto, for example) and I think the Anglophone rap scene has been struggling in the past couple of years. It might be because major labels only seem to be interested in French rap when it comes to Quebec. As for us specifically, I think we get decent recognition, but it's mostly from other people who are active in the scene. I'm talking about recognition for what we do with Audio Research and Obscure Disorder. I'm sure there's people who know about me from back in 97 when I won the DMC's but I generally get the impression that most of those people don't really know what I've been up to since then. But then again that's partially my fault because I've been doing a lot of stuff out of town and tend to lay low when I'm here. 
The Montreal scene is definitely not given enough credit. It's very slept on and I think that's due to its inherent complexity. Montreal is culturally/linguistically divided and that reflects into the hip hop scene. We couldn't have somebody like Kardinall bringing everybody together under the Jamaican patois umbrella because half the people speak French. As far as A-Trak and my recognition, we're not ghetto superstars but those who know know, and I wouldn't have it any other way. I wouldn't want more props than we deserve.

So then what is the difference between the Francophone and the Anglophone hip hop scenes, not including the language?  

It's the musical differences (namely different kinds of beats), geographical differences (because of French and English neighborhoods), fanbase differences. Those two scenes intersect to some extent but, like I said, I believe the lack of unity makes for a complex hip hop community that is difficult to grasp as a whole. However this complexity is also a sign of richness: the Montreal hip hop scene is absolutely unique and there's nowhere else I'd rather be associated with.

On a larger scale, in the past there have been very few Canadian hip hop figures that have had any sort of international recognition.  Not within the past 5 years, but before that.  The only person I can think of is like, Maestro Fresh Wes, and I think there was a point where people realized that there was only so much backbone sliding that could be done before something else had to come out of the woodwork.  What other Canadian hip hop groups do you see blowing up? 

I think Kardinal and Saukrates are sure shots. 
As far as Canadian acts that are next to blow, well, I guess I'll toot my own and mention DJ Serious and this new, as-yet-unnamed producer/emcee duo that's going to drop an EP on Audio Research in early January. Oh, also, as far as Montreal, I definitely have to big up Patrick Batemen: the hungriest new schoolers out there. 

In terms of when you guys were growing up, you went to high school and CEGEP at very different times.  Did you find that there was a lot of support for hip hop?  (side note for people that do not know about the quebec education system - CEGEP stands forCollège d'enseignement général et professionel and is like a two or three year pre-university college, basically like grade 12 and 13)

Not that much. When i was in high school and CEGEP a lot of people listened to "top 40" hip hop and R&B. There's only so much stuff they were exposed to. It was basically whatever you'd hear on the radio or saw on TV. Which isn't much here. I would never see them at the type of shows or clubs I'd be playing at. 
I discovered hip hop in high school with the group of friends that are now known as Obscure Disorder. There was some support, enough to make us want to keep at it to this day. 

Before that, how did you guys get into hip hop?  

Dave and I always listened to music together. Or rather, I would listen to whatever he was into at that time. We used to listen to a lot of 70's rock. Led Zeppelin and Hendrix all day. And weirder groups like Jethro Tull, King Crimson and Frank Zappa. And other classic stuff, like the Police. Then I remember when "Check Your Head" came out we started listening to a lot of Beastie Boys. After that we gradually got into groups like A Tribe Called Quest and De La, and Pete Rock & CL Smooth. And progressively we just got more and more into hip hop. 
Alain pretty much broke it down. I knew about hip hop since I was a kid, being brought up on MuchMusic and Video Hits. The first thing about hip hop that fascinated me was the graffiti, which I was exposed during trips to New York with my mom in the late 80s. Then in the early 90s I started tagging. I was already into a lot of funk and soul so, starting with groups like the Beastie Boys or records like "Midnight Marauders", things kept just evolving naturally. I was fortunate to be all into rap when classic records "Illmatic" and "The Infamous" came out; these records basically shaped my approach to the music. One thing about my brother and I is that we never front like we were listening to hip hop in '88. We still consider ourselves new jacks. 

Hahaha, of course.  There's always those people who claim to have been listening to like, Kool Herc back in the day, even though they were like 4, or not even born yet.  But umm, yeah.  What do your parents think of your music careers so far?  When you were growing up did they have anything in mind for you when you? 

At this point my parents are supportive of what I'm doing. I think I've earned their trust over the years. When I was first starting to cut they had no idea what the hell was going on. But then I won some titles and they saw how much work I was putting into this, and they became a bit more open-minded. My dad was always like, "as long as you keep your grades up you can continue doing this stuff." They were never really the type to impose any kind of hobbies or activities on Dave and I. We would always be doing our own thing. 
My pops put me on to music. My grandmother paid for my guitar lessons. But as far as doing hip hop and starting a record label, that was all us. I'll always remember, when I was telling my dad that Alain wanted to get some turntables, he was like "No, why doesn't he get a new tapedeck?" Now I think they're proud. They show our records to all their friends who visit. But essentially Alain and I are self-made. 

Most definitely.  Since both of you are so busy with all these projects though, what is it that keeps you motivated all the time?  

I just love music and have this passion for DJing, and it keeps me motivated. I love the feeling I get when I do a good show or finish a dope track, and I usually keep that in mind when I'm working - like I'm striving to get that feeling again. I think I also get motivated when I get the impression that my career still isn't where I want it to be. I'll be like, "man there should be 10 times more people giving me props; I bet you if I improve my live show it'll get people talking" and I'll go make up a new routine. 
The motivating force behind what I do is the desire to have my music heard and appreciated. Also, the people that hate my guts. There's a few and I love the feeling of knowing that they're pissed. Overall, not to sound like Terry Fox, but I think A-Trizzle and I are extremely competitive and always ready to set the bar higher for new challenges. 

With all this stuff that each of you do, do you ever feel outshadowed by each other?  

Not really. Well maybe personality-wise, like when we're both talking to people. I'm more in my own world, reserved and stuff, while he's the type of dude that talks really loud and says borderline arrogant stuff but that you can't help but listen to and laugh. But it's not a question of being outshadowed. Dave and I are really close and we're each other's biggest fans. I'm proud of anything and everything he does. 
I guess this question applies more to me because I'm the least known... And the answer is: never. My brother is one of my heroes and I live through everything that he does. The only thing I can feel is pride at this point. 

On that note, from what I've seen I think both of you have worked with people that you listened to when you were growing up.  Is that ever weird?  

No, I don't think it's weird. I just get really, genuinely happy when I get to work with people that I look up to. It feels like the hard work is paying off. Everybody that I've met is really down to earth, which is great. Dave and I were never into the whole industry-mingling, brown-nosing scene so I think we don't really get phased easily. We keep each other grounded. That's why it's so important to stay close to the people you grew up with - to stay grounded. 
To tell you the truth, I haven't really gotten a chance to work with a lot of bands that I was previously a fan of.  I can only name two: Montreal legends Shades of Culture and New York underground icons Non Phixion. In both cases I felt extremely fortunate and kept reminding them that I was (and still am) a fan, first and foremost.

Who would you like to collaborate with in the future? 

There's a bunch of people that I'd like to collaborate with. Basically anybody I'm a fan of, whether it be a producer or an MC. I want to cut on these people's songs. It could be Ghostface, OutKast, the Neptunes, Jay Dee, Eminem, the Roots, whoever. I'm really glad that we got to work with Madlib on the Obscure Disorder LP. I definitely plan on doing more stuff with him in the future. 
I'm not sweating collabos that much. I'd much rather develop my label and it's roster and through that, gain notoriety. I'm perfectly at ease working with the emcees I know. 

You mentioned Ghostface.  Given gangsta rap's allegedly wack reputation, what do you think of it?  

I like some gangsta rap. If it's dope, if it's done well, then I like it. The gangsta factor isn't really an issue with me. Dre and Snoop are considered gangsta rap. So is DJ Quik, even though he won't say it. Or even groups like the Lox, 50 Cent or Non Phixion. That's all gangsta rap, apparently. I like it! There must be 100 reasons why people like gangsta rap. Maybe because it's aggressive, and therefore it hits you in a different way than other types of music. The West Coast style of gangsta rap usually has really funky beats. Straight Parliament beats. Everybody likes Parliament. I think with all that angry gangsta rap has tapped into an audience that used to be reserved to heavy metal - the oh-so-often talked about suburban white teens.   
My thing is this: I'm presently doing a Ph.D. in literary theory and criticism. When I come home from school, I don't need some do-do from Anti-Pop Consortium trying to show me how smart and avant-garde he is. It's cool -- I got professors for that. When I listen to music, I need to be entertained. So a lot of times, a musical equivalent to the movie Scarface comes in handy. I love hearing rappers talking about killing people if it's done well. See, I'm all about form over content. I don't care about your subject matter as long as your lyrics got flavour. When rappers focus too much on content, it comes off contrived. I liked it when Q-Tip and KRS were dropping conscious shit on their classic albums because it sounded so natural. Nowadays, some rappers that try to be all educated and intelligent end up sounding like pompous idiots. Buy a gun, or talk about your dick or something. 

Next, we move on to Audio Research.  Like a Polish delicatessen, Dave and Alain's Audio Research is a family affair, sans the smelly kolbassa.  Au contraire, it's music that they serve up, with the help of P-Thugg and Willo (who are responsible for admin and graphic design duties, respectively).   The Audio Research story begins with Obscure Disorder.  OD came about in late 1995, when all the members as well as Dave were still in high school.  He was in a band, and occasionally, OD would rap over this band's music.  Obscure Disorder wanted to record a demo, but during those days, there were no beatmakers in Montreal.  So it was all up to Dave.  Due to his lack of resources, he had to borrow other people's equipment, but eventually a demo for "Sinpreshin'" was recorded. ("Which already featured a 13 year old A-Trak," adds Dave) Two years later, Dave bought his own equipment, and since then, one of the illest producers outta Montreal has emerged.  Then how does Audio Research fit into this bit?  Well, Audio Research was started up in 1997 to release Obscure Disorder's "lyrically exposed".  From then on, they've gone on to releasing more stuff from OD, DJ serious, Brassmunk, D-styles, and Simalahk.  A battle records division called Ammo Records was also formed, which has released A-Trak's "Gangsta Breaks", and DJ Craze's "Bully Breaks".    

For more info on the projects of A-Trak and Dave One, check out djatrak.com, audioresearch.net, the allies website, and contagiousmusiq.com.